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Do these grow through plants?

Hi all,

I've just moved and am going to try and make a cottage style border in my garden, but I'm unsure of the growing nature of the following - Iris', Papavers, Verbena Bonariensis, Gladioli and Alliums. Do these plants require their own designated growing space, or will they compete and climb up through other plants? I really want to fill my borders up and would love to have these plants, but just don't know the habit of their growth.

Also, geraniums, do they only have a small crown? I thought they were more of a scrambler and didn't have much of a base, so wondered, when it says spread 45cm - 60cm, does this mean I shouldn't fill in the ground in between, or can I plant up against them and they'll grow over over plants?

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  • nutcutletnutcutlet Posts: 27,445

    Hi Adam

    Alliums will come through anything that's not too thick or tall. Verbana bonariensis will need a space. What sort of iris and papaver and gladioli? Geraniums vary in their habit. Some spead by roots, some expand slowly, some spread far and wide in summer and it all dies off in winter to starts again next year. Any idea what sort you've got?



    In the sticks near Peterborough
  • sotongeoffsotongeoff Posts: 9,802

    Adam

    You need to allow space for perennial plants to spread-so when you set up your border you will have gaps -in the first year as plants are getting settled rather than bare soil fill those gaps with annuals-iris,aliums, gladiolis being single stemmed flowers will just grow though.

  • I'm going to grow stuff roughly 2/3 the recommended planting distance for non-sprawling plants, as I need to cram in the plants. But help is appreciated in knowing what can be grown through.

    Geranium-wise, I'm going for a few, Rozzane, Splish Splash, Versicolour, Pratense Purple Haze, Rise & Shine, Buxton Blue & Oxonianum Pink Lace (obviously not all in the same border).

    Papavers - Pink Fizz by T&M, Orientale Royal Wedding & Grape.

    Irsis' - Haven't thought of any yet.

    Gladioli - Yet to have a look, but figured they could be squeezed in due to their upright habit, though I realise they will look a little dis-jointed if dotted rather than grown en-masse.

  • nutcutletnutcutlet Posts: 27,445

    Geranium Rozanne is one of the annual growth and die back ones, lovely, weaves through other plants, pratense is taller and stiff but inclined to fall over for me. Splish splash is a pratense. versicolor is quietly nice not dramatic front of the border likes bit of shade.  I haven't grown the others.

    Oriental poppies are spectacular in their moment then die back and need something in front of them to hide the dying leaves. Don't know pink fizz. 

    Lots of different species of iris, all different requirements

    Think carefully about glads, they are spectacular but to my mind don't 'fit in' easily



    In the sticks near Peterborough
  • I know what you mean, Nutcutlet.  The smaller ones might go nicely with some of the other plants listed, byzantinus or butterfly glads (?)

  • Know what you mean about Glads, but thankfully there are enough varieties to match colours, etc. So Papavers - do they need their own space or will they grow through? I know about the life of the plant, as in short lived, dies back, can re-bloom if cut back to ground, but will eventually leave an empty hole. The point is, do I have to make room for them initially, or can they be planted right up against perennials when dormant? Hope I'm making sense image

  • Also, just to give you an idea of scale, the border is an 'L' shape, with one part 3.3m x 1.5m and 3.1m x 1.5m. They were going to be based on thirds at 1.2m, but I wouldn't have been able to use the space hungry Lupins, Digitalis or Delphs. As it is I'm gutted because I know I just can't fit in Acanthus Mollis Bears Breaches image

  • nutcutletnutcutlet Posts: 27,445

    The papavers will need space like everything else. They spread their leaves out and so will the next plant the strongest will win and the weakest get swamped.



    In the sticks near Peterborough
  • I have papavers growing cheek by jowl with vigorous plants. The flowers come through and show up well and the leaves, which are not particularly beautiful, are hidden by the other plants. I do think they'd do better and have more impact if they had more space, and I'm trying to give them a bit more. However, they don't much like being moved, so it is the other plants which will probably have to be moved.

    Bearded irised need to bake in the sin and don't look wonderful in a crowded border, I think. They don't flower for long, either, and I'm thinking of taking mine out.

    I have also planted things closer than the recommended distance apart. It works, but there is a need to be vigilant and cut back at least the outer leaves of plants that would usually be allowed to die back naturally. Otherwise, you just get a disorganised mess. That cottage look is a lot less haphazard than it appears and is actually quite a lot of work.

  • Thanks guys. I think based on advice, I'm not gona bother with Iris', Papavers or Glads. I'll make room for Bonariensis as it's more transparent, and I'll make room for Alliums, as the advice is they'll grow up through less vigorous plants.

    Looking forward to May time when I can start planting up the beds. I've never grown in a garden bigger than 7', so am very excited, even if there is a lot of work involved, but hey, ait's all part of the fun! Cheers guys!!

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